Why Removing Gamecube Support From The Wii U Was A Bad Idea.

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tta
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Why Removing Gamecube Support From The Wii U Was A Bad Idea.

Postby tta » February 2nd, 2013, 2:12 pm

Most of you probably know that Nintendo decided to make the Wii U only backwards-compatible with Wii games, enhancing their image quality. There are rumors of GameCube games being released on Virtual Console, but we all know that it will most likely only be Nintendo-produced titles. Of course, there are also the "New Play Control" games, but the only games on there are Metroid Prime, Pikmin, their respective sequels, Donkey Kong Jungle Beat, and Mario Power Tennis. Here are the reasons that I think the Wii U should have stayed compatible with GameCube games and peripherals:

1: Alot of Wii games control more practically with GameCube controllers.

Take Super Smash Bros. Brawl and Sonic Colors for example, Both of which are games that deserve to be in HD. Since the Wii U does not support GameCube peripherals, the only options for playing would be the Classic Controller, Remote sideways, and Remote w/ Nunchuck.

2: GameCube games have never really gotten a chance to be in HD

I was thinking that Nintendo would learn from Sony's mistake of ditching PS2 and PS1 support in the newer models of the PS3. For the most part they did, by keeping Wii support, but there are SO MANY 6th generation games that would be an absolute joy to be played in HD. Point 3 further explains this.

3: The GameCube has an arguably better library of games.

Games for the GameCube that are Audience-Acclaimed and deserve to be in HD (More or less) are including (Not including New Play Control), but not limited to:

Alien Hominid
Animal Crossing
Beyond Good & Evil
Billy Hatcher and the Giant Egg
Chibi-Robo
Crash Bandicoot: The Wrath of Cortex
Crazy Taxi
Custom Robo
Eternal Darkness: Sanity's Requiem
I-Ninja
Kirby Air Ride
Pikmin (Note 2)
Pikmin 2 (Note 2)
The Legend of Zelda: OoT Master Quest (Maybe...?)
The Legend of Zelda: Wind Waker (Note 3)
The Legend of Zelda: Twilight Princess (Note 2)
Luigi's Mansion (Note 1)
Mario Kart: Double Dash!!
Mario Party 4-7
Metroid Prime (Note 2)
Metroid Prime 2: Echoes (Note 2)
Pac-Man World 2
Pac-Man World 3
Paper Mario: The Thousand Year Door (SO MUCH YES)
Phantasy Star Online I-III
Pokemon Channel (Note 1)
Pokemon Colosseum
Pokemon XD: Gale of Darkness
Rayman 3: Hoodlum Havoc
Sonic Adventure DX: Director's Cut
Sonic Adventure 2: Battle
Sonic Gems Collection
Sonic Heroes (Note 1)
Sonic Mega Collection
Soulcalibur II
Spider-Man
Super Mario Sunshine
Super Monkey Ball
Super Monkey Ball 2
Super Smash Bros. Melee
Tak and the power of Juju
Viewtiful Joe
Viewtiful Joe 2

Note 1: This is Debatable.
Note 2: This doesn't really count because it was Released for Wii also.
Note 3: This doesn't really count because it's being re-released on Wii U.

And, keep in mind, I did say "Not limited to". Any 2 of these games would be enough reason to buy a GameCube, especially ones like Super Monkey Ball 2 or Super Smash Bros. Melee.

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Postby ElectroYoshi » February 2nd, 2013, 3:12 pm

I was actually just about to post a thread about this.
Then I read this one and realized you summed it up absolutely PERFECTLY.

It is stupid that GameCube games aren't playable on the Wii U. As far as outward appearance is concerned, the Wii U is really not that much different from the Wii...
I need a shot again, that sweet adrenaline.

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Postby Soccerstar » February 2nd, 2013, 3:22 pm

When I first saw the Wii U, I was all like "OMG we should get this." You know, like an impulse buy. I have a Wii and a bunch of NGC games, but I kept the actual GameCube console itself because . . . I dunno, nostalgia or something, which is the only reason I was debating whether to get a Wii U. But now I realize that no NGC compatibility is just one of the many cons of the new console . . . if anyone reading this is debating whether to get one, I would say save your money for an Xbox 720 or PS4.

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Postby tta » February 2nd, 2013, 4:16 pm

ElectroYoshi wrote:I was actually just about to post a thread about this.
Then I read this one and realized you summed it up absolutely PERFECTLY.


Thank you my good sir, I tried to squeeze as much as I could in there. :D

Soccerstar wrote:When I first saw the Wii U, I was all like "OMG we should get this." You know, like an impulse buy. I have a Wii and a bunch of NGC games, but I kept the actual GameCube console itself because . . . I dunno, nostalgia or something, which is the only reason I was debating whether to get a Wii U. But now I realize that no NGC compatibility is just one of the many cons of the new console . . . if anyone reading this is debating whether to get one, I would say save your money for an Xbox 720 or PS4.


I'm sure that Super Smash Bros U is going to change everything and make the Wii U worth buying, like the SSB series did with all of the consoles prior, unless Namco ruins everything. :/

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Postby Soccerstar » February 2nd, 2013, 5:04 pm

But unless they're some sort of Smash Bros fangirl/boy not many people will buy a $300 console for one game. In my opinion.

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Postby tta » February 3rd, 2013, 12:06 am

That said, Smash bros. is a magnificent series and would probably boost Wii U sales by at least 20%.

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Postby Wowfunhappy » February 3rd, 2013, 12:07 pm

Here's the thing though: The Gamecube is old. The average consumer walking into a Gamestop store isn't going to see Gamecube games lining the store shelves. So the people who want Gamecube support are either A) Enthusiasts who will go out of their way to track down used copies of games on eBay or Amazon, or, B) People who bought the games when they were new.

The number of people in Group A is fairly small, and Nintendo would probably prefer that they buy games from the likely in-development Gamecube Virtual Console anyway.

The people in Group B must have a Gamecube or Wii already. Those consoles are pretty durable, and won't break easily. Granted, keeping old consoles looked up to a TV can be a hassle, but remember that backwards compatibility would increase the Wii U's price. How much would you be willing to pay for the extra convenience? Perhaps more importantly, how much are you willing to force everyone else to pay, the people who probably wouldn't take advantage of GC compatibility in the first place.

And, as is already noted but bares additional emphasis, many games on the above list are playable on the Wii U in some form. The [url='http://www.amazon.com/Metroid-Trilogy-Collectors-Edition-Nintendo-Wii/dp/B002ATY7JE/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1359910113&sr=8-1&keywords=metroid+prime+trilogy']Metroid Prime games[/url], the [url='http://www.amazon.com/New-Play-Control-Pikmin-Nintendo-Wii/dp/B001CTL5GQ/ref=sr_1_2?s=videogames&ie=UTF8&qid=1359910149&sr=1-2&keywords=Pikman']Pikman[/url] [url='http://www.amazon.com/Nintendo-Selects-Pikmin-2-Wii/dp/B0081716P2/ref=sr_1_1?s=videogames&ie=UTF8&qid=1359910149&sr=1-1&keywords=Pikman']games[/url], and [url='http://www.amazon.com/Legend-Zelda-Twilight-Princess-Nintendo-Wii/dp/B004WLRQMI/ref=sr_1_1?s=videogames&ie=UTF8&qid=1359910238&sr=1-1&keywords=Twilight+Princess']Twilight Princess[/url] were re-released for the Wii. [url='http://www.polygon.com/2013/1/23/3906998/the-legend-of-zelda-wind-waker-hd-remake-coming-to-wii-u-by-this-fall']Wind Waker is getting a Wii U remake[/url] which will be out this fall. [url='http://www.amazon.com/Super-Smash-Bros-Brawl-Nintendo-Wii/dp/B000FQ9R4E/ref=sr_1_1?s=videogames&ie=UTF8&qid=1359910429&sr=1-1&keywords=Super+Smash+Brothers']Super Smash Brothers has a sequel for the Wii[/url], with a Wii U version coming in the future.

There are DRM-free PC versions of [url='http://www.gog.com/gamecard/beyond_good_and_evil']Beyond Good and Evil[/url] and [url='http://www.gog.com/gamecard/rayman_3_hoodlum_havoc']Rayman 3[/url] available for download on GOG.com. Because of how old these games are, just about any computer will be able to run them without problems. You can also buy retail copies of [url='http://www.amazon.com/Pac-Man-World-2-Playstation/dp/B00005V6BP/ref=sr_1_1?s=videogames&ie=UTF8&qid=1359910959&sr=1-1&keywords=Pacman+World+2']Pacman World 2[/url] [url='http://www.amazon.com/Pac-Man-World-3-Pc/dp/B000BKKJY6/ref=sr_1_1?s=videogames&ie=UTF8&qid=1359911043&sr=1-1&keywords=Pacman+World+3+PC']and 3[/url] from Amazon, although be aware that you'll need a copy of Windows XP for them to work (I know because I own them).

The Phantasy Star Online games have had their servers cut off, so you wouldn't be able to play them anyway.

My point is, for a lot of these games, you have options. For the rest, I'm guessing there will be a Gamecube Virtual Console at some point down the road.

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Postby tta » February 3rd, 2013, 5:16 pm

Wowfunhappy wrote:Here's the thing though: The Gamecube is old. The average consumer walking into a Gamestop store isn't going to see Gamecube games lining the store shelves. So the people who want Gamecube support are either A) Enthusiasts who will go out of their way to track down used copies of games on eBay or Amazon, or, B) People who bought the games when they were new.

The number of people in Group A is fairly small. Nintendo would probably prefer that they instead buy games from the likely-in-development Gamecube Virtual Console anyway.

The people in Group B must have a Gamecube or Wii already. Those consoles are pretty durable, and won't break easily. Granted, keeping old consoles looked up to a TV can be a hassle, but remember that backwards compatibility would increase the Wii U's price. How much would you be willing to pay for the extra convenience? Perhaps more importantly, how much are you willing to force everyone else to pay, the people who probably wouldn't take advantage of GC compatibility in the first place.

And, as is already noted but bares additional emphasis, many games on the above list are playable on the Wii U in some form. The [url='http://www.amazon.com/Metroid-Trilogy-Collectors-Edition-Nintendo-Wii/dp/B002ATY7JE/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1359910113&sr=8-1&keywords=metroid+prime+trilogy']Metroid Prime games[/url], the [url='http://www.amazon.com/New-Play-Control-Pikmin-Nintendo-Wii/dp/B001CTL5GQ/ref=sr_1_2?s=videogames&ie=UTF8&qid=1359910149&sr=1-2&keywords=Pikman']Pikman[/url] [url='http://www.amazon.com/Nintendo-Selects-Pikmin-2-Wii/dp/B0081716P2/ref=sr_1_1?s=videogames&ie=UTF8&qid=1359910149&sr=1-1&keywords=Pikman']games[/url], and [url='http://www.amazon.com/Legend-Zelda-Twilight-Princess-Nintendo-Wii/dp/B004WLRQMI/ref=sr_1_1?s=videogames&ie=UTF8&qid=1359910238&sr=1-1&keywords=Twilight+Princess']Twilight Princess[/url] were re-released for the Wii. [url='http://www.polygon.com/2013/1/23/3906998/the-legend-of-zelda-wind-waker-hd-remake-coming-to-wii-u-by-this-fall']Wind Waker is getting a Wii U remake[/url] which will be out this fall. [url='http://www.amazon.com/Super-Smash-Bros-Brawl-Nintendo-Wii/dp/B000FQ9R4E/ref=sr_1_1?s=videogames&ie=UTF8&qid=1359910429&sr=1-1&keywords=Super+Smash+Brothers']Super Smash Brothers has a sequel for the Wii[/url], with a Wii U version coming in the future.

Their are DRM-free PC versions of [url='http://www.gog.com/gamecard/beyond_good_and_evil']Beyond Good and Evil[/url], [url='http://www.gog.com/gamecard/rayman_3_hoodlum_havoc']Rayman 3[/url], and [url='http://www.gog.com/gamecard/psychonauts']Psychonauts[/url] available for download on GOG.com. Because of how old these games are, just about any computer will be able to run them without problems. You can also buy retail copies of [url='http://www.amazon.com/Pac-Man-World-2-Playstation/dp/B00005V6BP/ref=sr_1_1?s=videogames&ie=UTF8&qid=1359910959&sr=1-1&keywords=Pacman+World+2']Pacman World 2[/url] [url='http://www.amazon.com/Pac-Man-World-3-Pc/dp/B000BKKJY6/ref=sr_1_1?s=videogames&ie=UTF8&qid=1359911043&sr=1-1&keywords=Pacman+World+3+PC']and 3[/url] from Amazon, although be aware that you'll need a copy of Windows XP in order for them to run (I know because I own them).

The Phantasy Star Online games have had their servers cut off, so you wouldn't be able to play them anyway.

My point is, for a lot of these games, you have options. For the rest, I'm pretty sure there will be a Gamecube Virtual Console at some point down the road.


To reply to this all in a few words, I'll just say this: What I was saying wasn't referring to "options".

1. Or C: Someone who likes and enjoys a good game regardless of how old it is.

2. Virtual console isn't going to solve everything. It's going to most likely have a VERY limited selection (probably 1/3 of the games I listed). Also, why should I have to pay for games that I already own and more? They're doing what Sony did with PSN, re-releasing PS1/PS2 games after ditching PS1/PS2 support for the sake of money.

3. Like you said, I already noted that. Also, Super Smash Bros. installments aren't all the same game.

4. I know there are PC versions of those games, but console gaming is more convenient in some cases IMO, and it's also safe to assume that some people getting a Wii U might not have a PC, let alone one running XP and let alone one with specs good enough to even RUN those games. In this post I refrained from mentioning other consoles and their "options", because in this thread I'm only talking about the Wii U and it's capabilities.

5. I've never played any of the Phantasy Star games, but I do know that they had their servers shut down, but I assumed they had more playability than online play.

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Postby Zetta » February 3rd, 2013, 6:25 pm

Speaking of Phantasy Star Online, there isn't really much reason to play it because Phantasy Star Online 2 is already out in Japan and making its way to the rest of the world soon.

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Postby Skyshark » February 3rd, 2013, 7:16 pm

Well, I guess there's another reason not to buy the Wii U.

As for playing past games, I hate the fact that newer systems are phasing out support for older games. Someone should make a new system that would act like basically a super-emulator, with the ability to run Nintendo, Super Nintendo, Gamecube, Xbox, N64, PS1 and PS2 games and more. I'd pay good money for that.

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Postby Echo » February 3rd, 2013, 8:17 pm

Skyshark wrote:Well, I guess there's another reason not to buy the Wii U.

As for playing past games, I hate the fact that newer systems are phasing out support for older games. Someone should make a new system that would act like basically a super-emulator, with the ability to run Nintendo, Super Nintendo, Gamecube, Xbox, N64, PS1 and PS2 games and more. I'd pay good money for that.

It'd be to expensive and basically just end up being a computer. Not to mention it would be highly illegal.

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Postby Skyshark » February 3rd, 2013, 10:37 pm

Echo wrote:It'd be to expensive and basically just end up being a computer. Not to mention it would be highly illegal.


How would it be illegal? It'd be a system that can simply run the games, not illegally download them. Since most new systems are nixing backwards compatibility, I bet you could get a lot of business from people who want to play their old Nintendo or PS1 games without the hassle of repairing an original system.

And yeah, that's the point -- it'd be a computer designed specifically for running games. All game systems are technically computers.

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Postby Wowfunhappy » February 3rd, 2013, 11:19 pm

tta wrote:Or C: Someone who likes and enjoys a good game regardless of how old it is.

But those people still fall into Group A. They're enthusiasts, like us. Old games may be great, but you won't walk into a Gamestop and see them lining store shelves. So you'd have to research older games to find out that they exist in the first place, and then spend time tracking them down on Amazon or eBay. The number of people willing to do this just isn't that high.

I know there are PC versions of those games, but console gaming is more convenient in some cases IMO, and it's also safe to assume that some people getting a Wii U might not have a PC, let alone one running XP and let alone one with specs good enough to even RUN those games.

The part about Windows XP... yeah, but that only applies to the Pac Man world games. The others I mentioned will run fine on Windows Vista/7/8.

Thing is, contrary to what Steve Jobs would have had us believe, we're not in the "Post-PC era" just yet. Almost EVERYONE owns some sort of PC. It may not be a good PC, and probably won't be able to run a majority of modern games. But the great thing about older games is that, because they're old, they don't need a good computer to run. You can play Beyond Good & Evil on pretty much anything.

I agree, being able to play a console would still be better, but when you realize how few people would really make use of backwards compatibility for such an old console, you can understand why Nintendo made the decision.

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Postby Echo » February 4th, 2013, 12:20 am

Skyshark wrote:How would it be illegal? It'd be a system that can simply run the games, not illegally download them. Since most new systems are nixing backwards compatibility, I bet you could get a lot of business from people who want to play their old Nintendo or PS1 games without the hassle of repairing an original system.

And yeah, that's the point -- it'd be a computer designed specifically for running games. All game systems are technically computers.

I read that wrong, it wouldn't be illegal, but still expensive and hard to do. 1 emulator takes a lot of work on it's own and even then may be buggy. A few of those already exist though, so your best bet is getting a high end computer and installing emulators. I doubt anyone would ever make a system like that, because the audience would be very small and they probably wouldn't turn a profit.

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Postby Swords761 » February 4th, 2013, 12:50 am

Isn't there a Wii U Pro Controller that is basically better than the Gamecube and Classic controllers? Only problem I guess with that is you have to buy another new thing instead of reusing old stuff, but I mean, it's pure luck you can reuse Wii remotes as Nintendo could have easily made you rebuy those. In fact, besides going from PS2 -> PS3 I can't remember a new gen from any of the major 3 that didn't involve rebuying controllers.

And I think all three of your points are just excuses to complain about lack of HD Nintendo games. You expect too much too soon, so be patient and let them slowly re-release games with HD support like they are clearly planning on doing throughout the next few years. And I disagree with the thought of graphics being a dealbreaker for a machine; obviously everyone prefers HD and nice looking, sharp and clear things, but that's worthless when the mechanics and gameplay and performance have to take a hit from lack of focus.
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Postby tta » February 4th, 2013, 5:11 pm

Swords761 wrote:Isn't there a Wii U Pro Controller that is basically better than the Gamecube and Classic controllers? Only problem I guess with that is you have to buy another new thing instead of reusing old stuff, but I mean, it's pure luck you can reuse Wii remotes as Nintendo could have easily made you rebuy those. In fact, besides going from PS2 -> PS3 I can't remember a new gen from any of the major 3 that didn't involve rebuying controllers.

And I think all three of your points are just excuses to complain about lack of HD Nintendo games. You expect too much too soon, so be patient and let them slowly re-release games with HD support like they are clearly planning on doing throughout the next few years. And I disagree with the thought of graphics being a dealbreaker for a machine; obviously everyone prefers HD and nice looking, sharp and clear things, but that's worthless when the mechanics and gameplay and performance have to take a hit from lack of focus.


1: Yes, but the positioning is strange, and I would assume it's not compatible with Wii Games.

2: As I've said before, Virtual Console and Re-Releases aren't going to fix everything. Let's do some math:

There are 646 GameCube games, let's say that only 323 of them are good. If Nintendo were to Re-Release GameCube games, they or any other company wouldn't re-release 646 games, not even 323 or even 100 games, so best case scenario is that they would release 10-60 games. That's less than 10% of the total games and less than 20% of the good games.

3: And lastly, I don't prefer graphics over gameplay, but that doesn't mean that I don't think that graphics matter. It's like saying that Halo would be just as good as it is now if it were on the NES.

Echo wrote:I read that wrong, it wouldn't be illegal, but still expensive and hard to do. 1 emulator takes a lot of work on it's own and even then may be buggy. A few of those already exist though, so your best bet is getting a high end computer and installing emulators. I doubt anyone would ever make a system like that, because the audience would be very small and they probably wouldn't turn a profit.


Yeah, It's not illegal at all, as long as it's not retail. There's a portable NES/SNES player on Amazon.

Wowfunhappy wrote:The part about Windows XP... yeah, but that only applies to the Pac Man world games. The others I mentioned will run fine on Windows Vista/7/8.


Well no.

I bought Rayman 3 for PC once, but it was only M.E./2000/XP and didn't work on my 7 computer. As for PsychoNauts and BG&E, I don't know. (Also, Psychonauts isn't a GC game, just throwing that out there.)

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Postby tta » February 4th, 2013, 5:14 pm

Echo wrote:I read that wrong, it wouldn't be illegal, but still expensive and hard to do. 1 emulator takes a lot of work on it's own and even then may be buggy. A few of those already exist though, so your best bet is getting a high end computer and installing emulators. I doubt anyone would ever make a system like that, because the audience would be very small and they probably wouldn't turn a profit.


Yeah, It's not illegal at all, as long as it's not retail. There's a portable NES/SNES player on Amazon.

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Re: Why Removing Gamecube Support From The Wii U Was A Bad Idea.

Postby Rattle » April 24th, 2016, 7:03 pm

i was right

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Re: Why Removing Gamecube Support From The Wii U Was A Bad Idea.

Postby Miniike » April 25th, 2016, 7:38 am

Rattle wrote:i was right

you prophetic prophet
:pigflag: for fricking fricks sake why do i still care :pigflag:
:lock: 1. Wild Life 2. China Pig 3. The Blimp (Mousetrapreplica) 4. Sugar N' Spikes 5. Ant Man Bee :lock:
:bomb: you'll love it, it's a way of life :bomb:


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